>> brian: you also don't have a belly but the be of the is that true? >> gretchen: i do have a belly button. >> i do. >> steve: what kind of research -- it's hard to call her a liar when she said she -- she had one. >> brian: she doesn't have one. >> gretchen: have a great day bill: good morns, everybody, 9:00 here in new york. 9:00 in boston. new information we're gathering out of that town. u.s. officials giving fox new details working theory how and why of the boston bombings. the two brothers apparently acted alone and motivated by radical islam and wanted to target americans and they built pressure cooker bombs with help from al qaeda's online magazine. good morning. that is brand new information here. i'm bill hemmer as we work through this information to try to sort this story together. good morning, martha. martha: good morning, everybody. i'm martha ma.

we're getting new information as the lone suspect was read his rights while handcuffed to his bed. this is the man we talked so much about, dzhokhar tsarnaev. he is formerly -- formally charged with using a weapon of mass destruction. the 19-year-old could get the death penalty if he is convicted in this case. authorities say he has admitted to his role in the attack. bill: the details in the criminal complaint describe how calm the suspect appears after the explosions amid all the pandemonium and chaos. and how the death toll could have been much higher. molly line outside of the hospital. we're getting a timeline of the suspect's actions. what do we believe those actions were on monday afternoon? >> reporter: this information coming from an affidavit of a top fbi agent involved in the case the documents were released yesterday. how things played out the

evidence they have. they have a lot of videotape evidence. according to the affidavit, suspect one and suspect two showed up in the area about 11 minutes before these bombs went off, both carrying large knapsacks. they detach from the crowd, reposition, then bomber two, dzhokhar tsarnaev who remains here in the hospital, the man in custody now, is seen slipping his knapsack onto the ground. here is precisely what the agent writes. approximately 30 seconds seconds before the first explosion lifts his phone to his ear as if speaking on his cell phone and keeps it there for 18 seconds. a few seconds later he finishes the call. the large crowd of people around him are reacting to the first explosion. virtually every head turns to the east towards the finish line and stares in that direction in apparent bewilderment and alarm. bomber two, virtually alone among individuals in the restaurant appears calm. this is one of the reasons that he stood out so

significantly to investigators and in that panic-stricken crowd. then the paperwork goes on to say, he glances to the east and then calmly but rapidly moves, begins moving to the west, away from the direction of the finish line. he walks away without his knapsack having left it on the ground where he had been standing. approximately 10 seconds later an explosion occurs in the location where bomber two had placed his knapsack. bill. bill: this man is shot in the throat. we're told not to assume this was self-inflicted but he is offering a confession from his hospital bed in some manner and by some sort. how would that be, molly? >> reporter: actually this confession of some sorts, possibly really a warning, is something that happened during the carjacking according to this court he paperwork. this is revealed under the heading in these documents, as, bombers emerge. this happens after their photos are put out by the fbi. this is when fbi agents believe these suspects were

simply trying to flee the area. they're alleged to have carjacked a man in cambridge. victims tell authorities, that victim tells authorities that a man approached his vehicle, tapped on a passenger side window. here is quoting from the document. when the victim rolled down the window, the man reached in opening the door and entered the victim's vehicle. the man point ad firearm at the victim and stated, did you hear about that boston explosion? and i did that. the man removed the magazine from his gun and showed the victim it had bullet in it and reinserted the magazine. the man stated, i am serious. the carjack victim incredibly was able to escape unhurt to tell his story to authorities. his car not so fortunate. that car is filled with bullet holes. windows broken out during a subsequent gunbattle. not clear which of the two suspects made the statements to the carjacking victim. bill? bill: that statement is a major clue and the hunt for the suv. molly line there in boston.

>> reporter: thank you, bill. martha: the white house is taking heat from republicans for the decision to prosecute dzhokhar tsarnaev in civilian court but spokesman jay carney says that the administration pleased that they had no choice. >> he will not be treated as an enemy combatant. we will prosecute this terrorist through our civil system of justice. underu.s. law, the united states citizens can not be tried rather in military commissions. martha: but house armed services commission buck mckeown argues that the white house should reconsider. he says, quote, it seems premature to declare that we will not treat tsarnaev as an enemy combatant since we don't know about his affiliations. clearly american citizens must be tried to civilian court, but the same citizen viciously attacked his countrymen, should be exploited for his intelligence value before any trial begins. that will be a debate that rages on for some time on this issue. we'll talk more later in the show with former new york

city mayor rudy giuliani. bill: looking forward to that coming up here. meanwhile the feds want to talk to the widow of the suspect, tamerlan. she is mother of 3-year-old daughter between the two. the her lawyer said talks are underway with the feds how to proceed with that. he revealed on the last day tamerlan was home when his wife left for work. martha: well the officers who capturedded dzhokhar tsarnaev are speaking about the final moments of that man punt. newly-released of infrared video, this is the most amazing pictures. this is what they see from the cameras in the chopper. clearly you see there is something in that boat. the police finally closed in to rip away the boat's cover. the transit police officers who captured tsarnaev say they were glad they were to get that search finally over with that night. >> we just wanted to get him into custody and have the situation come to an end.

we don't feel relief or anything because the scene is not clear yet. >> you really don't have time to be afraid. maybe once we get to sit down, watch a little bit on the news. we haven't had a chance to rest yet. you revert back to your training. obviously your antenna goes up and your a drin lynn starts to go. after the time the call came in we were making our way through cambridge and ended up in a car chase. >> we're all military veterans. this is probably new ground. this is something hopefully we never have to experience again. we happened to be in the right place at the right time. martha: military veterans who did not expect to see something like this on american soil. they had seen it overseas and did not want it here at home. so they went to the hospital to deliver the news of the capture in person to fellow transit officer richard donohue who was wounded in the manhunt. this is a newly-released photo.

look at this. that is the captain donahue on the left and mit officer sean collier who lost his life in this rampage. that is the two men together at graduation. we know sean collier, 26 years old lost his life in the shootout when the tsarnaev brothers were on the run. he was assassinated according to reports in his vehicle. bill: fox news alert right now because we're waiting for the first court appearance of the two menu accused of plotting a terrorist attack against a canadian passenger train. they wanted believed to be attack a train traveling between the u.s. and canada. this is the first knownt canadas experienced to date. >> i want to reassure our citizens while the rcmp believe the accused had the capacity and intent to carry out these criminal acts there was no imminent threat to the general public, rail employees, train passengers,

or infrastructure. bill: royal canadian mounted police there. canadian authorities say the men were working, quote, with direction and guidance from al qaeda members out of iran. iran denies the link. calling it part of hostile policies against tehran. more on that. martha: well, there is controversy this morning because passengers are dealing with a heck of a lot when they go to get on their flights yesterday and today. there is a lot of delays because of these forced furloughs that were a result of the budget cuts but the "wall street journal" has a story that says the fed are spending over a billion dollars on things like consultants and supplies and travel and grants. they're wondering why that money couldn't go to help folks in the control tower. passengers as you might imagine none too happy about this today. >> this has been the worst. i travel a lot. this ultimately has been the worse. i will never come to lax ever again. bill: oh. martha: the faa releasing a statement saying it will

quote, be working with the airlines and using a comprehensive set of air traffic management tools to minimize the delays and impacts of lower staffing as we move into the busy summer season. do you find that reassuring? i'm not sure i do. good morning stuart. stuart varney from the fox business network. stuart couldn't we move money over from consultants and grants to help folks out in the control tower? >> let me spell out what we're talking about. $500 million this year for consultants. $474 million in wrapts grants to make communities more liveable and sustainable. obvious, question, martha, take some money out of the consultants bucket and put it into air traffic controlsers bucket to avoid delays. president says can't do that. i don't have the flexibility to target nonessentials. can't do it. so the republicans introduced a bill that would specifically give the president that flexibility, to avoid this pain.

he threatened to veto it. that's where we stand this morning. more cuts are coming. more delays are coming. the president does not want the authority to target the cuts. martha: i mean there was that memo a while back from the agriculture department about meat inspections. they say can we move the money around a little bit so it is not so bad. they got a memo back from the administration, as long as the impact is as stated as we have stated. i'm paraphrasing there. who will ended up getting blame for this in the end, stuart? >> the president appears to want to blame, or the public to blame the republicans. they're stranded on the tarmac. they're not happy about it. so blame congress, blame the republicans. the republicans are saying, come on mr. president, pass this bill, get it through and get flexibility we need and we wouldn't have to have these delays. so both sides are going at each other here with the public in the middle. the public is delayed and the public is angry. martha: lax has one less visitor. >> i saw that sound bite.

martha: never going back to l.a. she will take a bicycle there if she wants to go. stuart, thank you very much. >> thank you, martha tell us how you really feel. john boehner was with us yesterday. said the move was garbage, pretty much. does not believe this is the tack you have to take given the sequester move. we're getting rolling. river levels could rise higher than originally thought. wow, look at that picture. you remember this, don't you? >> we have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it away from the fog of the controversy. martha: remember that, back in 20102010? well the controversy over the president's health care law refuses to go away as one of the architects of the plan, democratic senator max baucus, now says that he see as huge train wreck coming in this thing. bill: also after boss 10 the feds deciding the suspect in custody will be tried as a

civilian. is that the right move? we'll talk to rudy giuliani, who helped guide new york and the country for that matter after the attacks. >> i hate to call the event whatever it was a terrible tragedy. i don't know how you measure, whether it was official terrorism or unofficial, whatever, clearly anyone to act in such a manner is clearly an evil person. you hurt my feelings, todd. i did? when visa signature asked everybody what upgraded experiences really mattered...

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martha: there are new claims today that syria is using chemical weapons against its own people. a top israeli general says it has happened a multiple times. the u.s. is continuing to assess those reports saying the use of chemical weapons in syria would be entirely unacceptable. the president has said that would be a red line for the united states. the u.s. also demanding that the syrian regime safeguard those chemical weapons, not hand them over to terrorist groups. all of this is of great concern to --. bill: meantime this is on

our radar. possible remorse on obamacare. this is max baucus in ex-exchange with health and human services secretary kathleen sebelius. >> i see a huge train wreck coming down, you and i discussed this many times and i don't see any results yet. what can you do to help all these people around the country are going what in the world do i do and do i know what to do? bill: says an awful lot in that statement. john fund, columnist for "national review" magazine. >> thank you. bill: good morning. it got buried as you can understand given all the news we watched out of boston. you wrote a piece called, putting lipstick on the obamacare pig. part of the article relied on testimony or questions, rather of max baucus, a democrat we should point out up for re-election. what is his concern, john? >> whenever he goes book to montana we hear from small

businesses we don't know what is going on, we don't know what the rules are, we don't know what the costs are. one woman says i have four small business, each are below the 50 threshold to cover my employees. do i have to add up and do i have to cover or don't i? there are no rules or regulations. in this mess very few companies are highering new people because the uncertainty is so great. bill: he said small businesses have no idea what to do. they have no idea what to expect. he goes on to say you need data. do you have any data? you have only given me concepts, frankly and not data. do they not have that? are they still trying to figure it out too? >> jay rockefeller, democratic senator from west begin and one. architects of obamacare, told secretary sebelius a few weeks ago this is the most complicated piece of legislation congress ever passed and so far it is not

working. bill: he said if it is not done right the first time it will simply get worse. how so? >> well the premiums are going up dramatically as the government tries to put everybody in a one-size-fits-all program mandating all kinds of new benefits. there is all kinds of costs being added on. young people, if this plan goes forward on october fist as expected, young premiums will see their premiums go through the roof because part of obamacare is, we subsidize the care for older people who are going to get new health insurance by raising premiums on young people earnings even kathleen sebelius said that no one fully anticipated, that's a quote, those are her words now, no one fully anticipated the difficulties involved in setting up obamacare. why didn't they, john? it is their law. >> it is 1/6 of the economy and it has a lot of moving parts and frankly i think we reached the point where bureaucratic government, 20th century style can handle something this

complex without proper price signals and proper market signals. the health care industry is a mess. half of it is paid are by the government. they set prices for the other half which is privately managed. i don't think it works, health savings accounts and health plans and extending people a lifeline if they get really seriously sick the we need to send market signals. right now this thing is a train wreck and there is nothing --. bill: that is your solution. what's theirs? >> their solution is we should trust them to make it work. and maybe after a few years it will work but right now everybody is confused. and of course the problem with these democrats foresee is the 2014 midterm elections are coming and if obamacare isn't perceived as working, people are going to say, i'm upset. i'm mad. remember, president obama promised americans, if you like your health insurance you can keep it. bill: they were smacked in 2010. we'll see whether or not it is an issue in 2014. >> thank you. bill: john fund with us here

in new york today. 20 past, martha. martha: bracing for the worst but fighting back at the same time. where folks are filling sandbags around the clock right now to try to save their town from the devastating floodwaters. wait until you see the brand new pictures in on this. we've got a live report. >> we flooded five times but nothing anywhere near like this. this is the worst. money, and i avoid frustration. you'll find reviews on home repair to healthcare written by people just like you. you want to be sure the money you're about to spend is money well spent. angie's list -- reviews you can trust.

with the innovating and the transforming and the revolutionizing. it's enough to make you forget that you're flying five hundred miles an hour on a chair that just became a bed. you see, we're doing some changing of our own. ah, we can talk about it later. we're putting the wonder back into air travel, one innovation at a time. the new american is arriving.

♪ . bill: it can be. there is new study highlights the dangers of texting while driving even if you keep your eyes on the road. the texas transportation institute put voice detect apps to the test. found drivers took twice as long whether they texted

hand-free or not. the latest transportation department report from 2011 blames 3300 deaths on distracted driving crashes. martha: big problem. downpours triggered major floods in the midwest. warnings and watches from michigan and down to arkansas. waterways already swollen there breaching their banks from oklahoma to michigan. these folks are in a heap of trouble. look at these pictures. that is the illinois river. towns all along there, especially hard-hit. forecasters predicting an additional inch much of rain. look at this bus plowing its way through this prospect heights illinois. commuters are scrambling to make makeshift levies to keep floodwaters out of their homes and businesses. >> just trying to help all the neighbors out. sandbag around the houses and i've been helping the neighbors get in and out with my boat. >> it really brings the best out in people. you realize who your real true friends are when you've

got a disaster like this. martha: true. wfld anita padilla joins us from des plaines, illinois. what are the conditions like where you are? >> reporter: well, i'll tell you what, we've got a major improvement from where we are but these are all over the street. this is pretty nasty. it is a worm. i don't like to touch worms but, to show you what we've got here, these are all over the street here. you know they're in their basements. if you look over here, to my right here, there is an electrical line, an extension cord going from one unit to the other unit. that is a dangerous situation. but one unit has power. the other one doesn't. the one that doesn't is using that to pump out water at that remains in the basement. if you look inside some of the video we shot inside you can see what they're dealing with. a big muddy mess. these are the people to really the last to get drained out water here from the des plaines river has crested and flowed over on friday.

11 feet what they were looking at total, just under 11 feet. i checked with the mayor. he says they dropped about 2 1/2 feet from where they were but flood stage was at five feet. so they had six feet of additional water that flowed out of the banks into these homes. people in these homes say that when somebody drove by in a car it create ad ripple effect on their basement windows, cracked the windows and all that water just poured in like a waterfall. one woman was telling us she just brought a washing machine seven days before the storm came. and now everything is wiped out. she has about $30,000 of damage. but it is here in des plaines, illinois, where folks have not been able to even get to some of the cleanup efforts. they're hoping to be able to do that today after they're able to clear out some of the water, get that out of there and look at the damage and see what they have, what they have got but it is quite a mess. it is not just here in des plaines, it is pretty much all over the chicago area where we got drenched and

people are still trying to do that cleanup effort. so quite a mess here in chicago and where i am at in the des plaines. martha: boy, everybody that has been through this your hearts go out to them because it is a mess. we wish them well. anita, thank you very much. bill: so many times we sit here and say don't drive through the standing water. you don't know how deep it is. gets into the electrical system of the vehicle. look at this bus. wow. martha: how many times we've seen people stranded trying to climb out and sitting on top of the vehicle, swept away by water. bill: almost like riding the wake, behind the boat and you're water skiing and just trying to keep the level of the water high enough so it doesn't come in. martha: nobody on the back of that boat though, that is the problem. bill: music festival getting upstaged, skies light up. it was scene hundreds of miles away. the question is, what in the heck is that thing? martha: that is the question, what the heck is that? the white house is defending their decision to prosecute dzhokhar tsarnaev in

civilian court. former new york city mayor rudy giuliani joins us to tell us what he thinks about that. >> we should continue to hold him as an enemy combatant and, any information gathered from that investigation can not be used against him in court. if we question him about innocence or guilt, then he is entitled to a lawyer. i'm not worried about his court case. i want to gather intelligence.

bill: got some breaking news

now. we want to take you to capitol hill. that is where a hear something about to begin on immigration reform and homeland security secretary janet napolitano, her home state by the way remember, is arizona. she just sat down and will testify and face tough questions in the aftermath of the boston bombings. police believe that attack was carried out by two chechens pro russia who had been living in the u.s. for a bit more than 10 years. we'll watch the hearing for headlines here in america's newsroom. martha: several republican lawmakers are now questioning the obama administration's decision not to treat the boston bombing suspect dzhokhar tsarnaev as an enemy combatant. he will face a civilian trial in criminal court. civilian complaint is revealing details from the carjacking to the shootout in police. listen to this from the documents released yesterday. the man point ad firearm at the victim, the person who

was carjacked, did you hear about the boston explosion? and i did that. the man removed the magazine from his gun and showed the vipg tim it had a bullet in it and reinstated the magazine and stated, i am serious. new york city mayor, rudy giuliani helped lead the nation out of 9/11 terror attacks and we i will be remembered for that going forward and rely on you for your expertise how you break down these things. a lot of people bush for enemy combatant status. the white house doesn't want to go there. is that a wise decision on their part. >> i don't think so. martha: why? >> the white house is a in state of denial and has been that way since major hasan. this is created from the top, sense of political correctness that becomes very dangerous. the major hasan case should be studied in great detail and we should have learned lessons from it. major hasan was announcing his intentions for several years. people were complaining

about him. instead of being dismissed from the military and possibly prosecuted he was promoted which indicated to me back then a kind of fear, even the military is into this politically correct thing where, my food l -- goodness we don't want to offend anybody. we have this terrorist who is told, we're told by the russian government that he's a jihadist, that he is a danger, that he is a problem. we go interview him. he tells us he isn't and we walk away and do nothing else about it as far as i can tell. then he goes to russia and we don't pick that up. gosh, here's a guy designated by a foreign government as a dangerous guy. we couldn't pick up why he was dangerous. and, then he goes to russia and, did we ever ask the russian government, did the russian government have tapes? did they overhear conversations? do we ask the russian government for their evidence so we could find out how substantial that was? martha: you think the russian government was covering themselves. saying we know this about

this guy. we know he is in the united states. if something happens they will look back at us, why didn't you give us a heads up on this guy, right? from the reports that i have read, when they talked to him, they cleared him. at that point he was a boxer who wanted to, hopefully fight on the u.s. team, in the u.s. olympics as a boxer. so the turn in him happened after that point. but they said because unless we received any new negative information we weren't allowed to continue that investigation. really? >> i don't know who said they're not allowed to continue the investigation. the fact is, that the information from the russian government certainly gave them probable cause to investigate. martha: right. >> a government tells you somebody is a possible terrorist, that gives you the plenty of reason to investigate. also, even now, just accepting the fact that they acted alone, hard to believe they acted alone. where did the money come from all these years. martha: we're believing that he acted alone. that is what the 19-year-old told them in the hospital room. >> who paid for the tickets to russia? plane tickets to russia cost

a lot of money. did the guy fight to win money? where did the money come from to support their lifestyle including a six month trip to russia? there are a lot of questions. martha: he says it was my brother as idea. i didn't hook onto the idea until a week ago. we weren't working with anybody else. we built the bombs based on what we learned on the internet. there seems there is general acceptance at least right now from what is out there that that's the story. >> how about what was your brother doing for a living? who pays his bills? who pays for his bills? who paid for his trip to russia? what did he tell you about his trip to russia? in two to five minutes, yes or no can only write down we'll accept it? that is why the enemy combatant thing is so important. we should have weeks and weeks of analysis with this guy, not the first statement of him. his brother misled us we thought he was a terrorist. his brother fooled the fbi. will we let his second fool

the fbi? martha: what happens now? he has lawyers defending him. >> he was a wonderful kid and misled by this big bad brother to go kill an 8-year-old child, to in cold blood kill a police officer. this guy is a horrible criminal. they should stop all this nonsense he was misled by his brother. he is old enough not to have been misled by anybody. he is old enough to be held responsible for what he did. and i hope he ultimately gets the ultimate penalty that. right now all i'm interested in is in information. i want to know what does know? i do not accept the fact that they acted alone. the fact somebody was supporting them for two or three years. until we find that out, there should be no conclusion on the part of the white house as they have already said he acted alone. how they can say that astound me. martha: go back to one more question on this issue of patriot act and all the controversial things that are in place so we can file a warrant for surveillance of people's web sites, what the activity is on their cell phones and websites. he was putting out jihadist

videos, young tamerlan, 26-year-old. no fisa request to continue to surveil this guy? where are all the things we put in place that were so controversial should have had him on loss of lots of lists right? >> it should have. designation of him of someone of concern by the government should put him in a category that is really pretty sear us are. that doesn't happen a lot, that a foreign government tells you watch this guy, he is a terrorist. also the russians had no particular reason to focus on this guy. this man wasn't an enemy of putin. he wasn't someone who was politically involved in russia. basically they gave us this information for our own good. we should have done a lot more to follow up on it. martha: that is big part of this story i think we'll learn the lessons what happened here going forward. >> this is the first one we've blown. attorney general mukasey wrote a article yesterday. martha: great article. >> five situations where the fbi did similar type of

things. i think fbi is getting wrong signals from the top. the signals are, be careful, be careful. don't designate somebody incorrectly. as opposed to let's be careful we don't get another boston bombing like the one we got last week. martha: mayor, thank you so much. >> thank you. martha: great to have you here. see you soon i hope. thank you. bill: thank you, mayor. 20 minutes best the hour and checking the markets right now we're off and running. 94 points to the positive side. investors watching earnings certainly throughout the day today. appleby the way reports earnings a bit later this afternoon. so a lot of folks watching that. 101 on the positive side in about 10 minutes of trading. we'll watch it. to see if the bulls are running for now, martha. martha: officials are telling fox news they believe the boston suspects were motivated by rad -- radical islam but they don't appear to have any ties to larger terror groups at least according to the testimony of 19-year-old in a hospital bed. ambassador john bolton says this working theory could be

overlooking something very important. the ambassador joins us next as we continue the coverings coming up. bill: he always said the history would be the judge of his decisions. president bush is set to open his presidential library. a new polling shows people warming to the president. karl rove on the real legacy of his former boss. >> i have little desire to try to shape legacy. i have read a lot of history. prior to presidency and during the presidency. i realize it just takes time for the true history of any administration to show up. there is no need to try to shape it. ♪

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we just got this video in of one of the canadian terror suspects arriving at the toronto courthouse as those proceedings get underway this morning. we understand the first one we should here is raed jazzer is of the united arab emirates. the terror plot allegedly was against a train in canada. both are scheduled to appear in court. they said they had guidance and direction from terror groups in iran but there is not a lot of support at this point to make that connection. obviously a lot of that will be revealed. bill: meantime, martha, sorry for the interruption. 40 minutes ago we mentioned this. fox is learning that the feds are working on the theory that the tsarnaev brothers apparently acted alone. it is early. but that is the theory at the moment. we're told they built bombs

from al qaeda's online magazine and say authorities have yet to determine what the older brother did while in russia for the six months last year. there is a lot to get to with ambassador john bolton, former ambassador from the u.n. fox news contributor. good morning to you. you wrote a piece in the "washington times." just digest the information that just gave about two brothers acting alone. do we know that? this is what is being reported but -- >> this is way too premature to say this, way too premature. this is the obama's administration ideology coming out and political imperative to deny that international terrorism is still a threat. they contradict themselves in the very same breath of course we don't know what he did for the six months he was in russia. how you can say there is no international connection when that critical piece of information is not known. bill: it is quite possible they were motivated by radical islam. it is quite possible that they got their information online. it is quite possible they followed anwar a lackey was he was alive and motivated and influenced by him,

correct? >> it is possible. if you think you can know the answer to that in three days. this isn't fbi investigators. this is superman. i think they are potentially blinding themselves to the potential of international support networks for these terrorists. that they're tied in with broader terrorist networks, whether al qaeda or others. and our unwillingness or inability to investigate this further could put us at risk in future incidents. bill: two points on here. yet to determine what the older brother did while in russia for six months. did he study in dagestan or go into chechnya with communication back and forth. you write this on the screen for viewers from "the washington times." the key question for protecting america against future attacks of terrorism whether the brothers were controlled and directed by foreign operatives and whether they received training in bomb-making, terrorist tactics and weapons handling and the like. then i would wonder whether or not the question, did they, did this group overseas give the green light when it is time to make a move? >> i think that is a critical question which we

have completely inadequate information. let me deal with this chechen thing one second. obviously the bombing of the boston marathon had nothing to do with chechen desire for independence from russia. the chechens struggle ends if the russians has been taken advantage of by radical islamists and terrorist groups over the past several decades, to recruit chechens to engage in terrorist acts worldwide. having nothing to do with their chechen ethnicity. it is to be terrorists. they are from the caucuses. let's be clear where the word caulkcation comes from. they are very useful to some international terrorist groups. we can't say definitely what the motivation for these two brothers was. we can't say they were radicalized here. we don't know. we need, much, much more information. bill: to that point they have lived here more than 10 years. the other had a passport. the other could have a passport of if he understand had a claim of domestic

violence in the past three years. everything set up here has been designed to stop terrorists from coming here and doing harm. what then you do to develop a system people figuring out that are living here with that golden ticket with an american passport to prevent them from doing what we saw in boston? >> it shows you need a priority both to discover the international connection and look for the domestic, homegrown, self-radicalized people. they were nice kids and fit in. the terrorists will not wear tinfoil hats on their has. go back to the days of the cold war, people looked at alger hiss. accused of. he went to harvard law school. his brother donald is dean atchison's law partner. how could the man be a soviet spy. the point is, fit in. the point is not stand out as a potential terrorist the point is not to arouse suspicion until the time is right. bill: we learned a lesson then. thank you.

martha. martha: dozens of people were wounded in the boston bombings and many of them are still in the hospital this morning. we're going to the if an update from the doctors who are helping them recover. bill: also president obama's budget plan taking a bit of a heat for new taxes on middle class. that wasn't supposed to be the? how much families are supposed to pay. martha: there is the scene in denver. what a morning commute in lakewood, colorado. they're making it a slow-go. it is may next week, right? we'll be right back. the farmers' market.

maybe another headache will get in the way. maybe you'll have some friends over for dinner. maybe you'll have a migraine. if you have migraines with 15 or more headache days a month, you're living a maybe life. and you may have chronic migraine. but knowing this thing you're going through has a name means knowing you can find treatments that are right for you. go to mychronicmigraine.com to find a headache specialist. and don't live a maybe life. bill: rock concert taking on a whole new meeting. watch this guy. witnesses report seeing a flash more than 250 miles away, that is the stage of the concert, behind stage right, boom.

astronomers estimate the object was eight inches across only when it entered the atmosphere. that there, that there is a meteor, martha. at a rock concert. martha: that is a rock concert. yeah, i got it. we are getting new first-hand accounts from people hurt in the boston marathon bombing. dr. marc siegel is live at boston beth israel medical center. he spoke to one of the survivors today. good morning, doctor. >> martha, this is the other side of the story. not fear and terror, a story of courage and hope. a silver lining, people stood up to terrorists and survivors. we spoke to a 25-year-old survivor hit by a bomb at the finish line, started to bleed from her leg. her friend leo took his t-shirt, covered up the wound, stopped the bleeding, lifted her into his arms and carried her to safety. >> definitely will always be a scar but i'm not going to let them win. not going to let them stop me from living a normal,

happy healthy life. especially here in boston. because boston is a great city. >> great medical personnel in boston, working together with the survivors. doctors and nurses working around the clock. i spoke to dr. david king, a trauma surgeon who also operated in iraq. let's hear what he had to say. >> when i came into the emergency room and looked at the first wave of casualties, that were arriving from the marathon, i really thought to myself, i just, could have been, me looking back and beinging in iraq or afghanistan. it really, the pattern of injury was identical, it looked the same to me. >> unbelievable. martha, the next stage in the process is going to be rehabilitation. we interviewed people at boston spaledings rehabilitation center about how people will recover, psych logically and physically and achieve what

doctors call the new normal. martha: dr. marc siegel, thank you. bill: two men expected in courtney moment now. allegations they plotted to attack trains between the u.s. and canada. we're on that in a moment live. martha: we're monitoring a major hearing today on immigration reform. homeland security secretary janet napolitano among those testifying. a live report on that coming up here on "america's newsroom." [ female announcer ] everything that goes into a lennox system

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innovation never felt so good. martha: all right, fox news alert now, moments ago, one of the two south specks in an alleged terror plot against trains in canada and new york arrived in court in toronto. we're expected to learn new details this morning about the extent of that plot. as soon as those come in we'll get them to you because we're now starting a brand new hour of "america's newsroom" on a tuesday, today is. good to have y'all here. good to have you here. i'm martha maccallum. bill: good morning to you at home. good morning to you as well. both countries have been watching these two men for more than a year. according to investigators they are believed to have ties to al qaeda. martha: national correspondent steve centanni joins us live from washington. so, steve, what is the latest on all this morning? >> reporter: well martha the two suspects appear in court tore bail hearings. they're accused plotting to derail a passenger train

that travels international route from new york to toronto. one suspect is seen arriving in toronto for today's court appearance is 30-year-old. chiheb esseghaier. according to royal canadian mounted police he and his codefendant, 35-year-old, raed jaser, we have the first video of him arriving too, were planning to target a train, canada's equivalent of amtrak. authorities say they had done surveillance of trains and railways. they had received direction and guidance but no actual funding from al qaeda and their activities point up a shadowy relationship between al qaeda and iran. >> the individuals were receiving support from al qaeda elements located in iran. there is no information to indicate that these attacks were state-sponsored. >> reporter: the rcmp worked hand in hand with the fbi and homeland security in the u.s. it was eight month long

operation that went by the name, project smooth. martha. martha: it is fascinating to hear officials did have their eye on these two. what more do we know about them? >> reporter: they're not canadian citizens. firms didn't give their nationality but other canadian sources says one suspect is tunisian and one was from the united arab emirates. chiheb esseghaier was doing research in nanotechnology near montreal. this raises questions of shiite iran and mostly sunni al qaeda. iran denied a relationship with al qaeda and did so today. and u.s. believes certain al qaeda operatives are based in iran. in this case the connection is unclear. authorities say the canadian plot was only in planning stages. nobody was in immediate danger. martha: steve, thank you. >> reporter: you bet. bill: the mental health of a man accused of mailing ricin to president obama will take center stage in court today.

prosecutors in his home state of missouri, paul kevin curtis september poison letters to a senator and a local judge. if the bi said a search of his car and home found no evidence of ricin there or ingredients for the poison. we'll watch that in court today. martha: a car bomb targeting the french embassy in the libyan capitol of tripoli wounded at least three people. crumbled the walls surrounding the compound. windows were shattered there. several vehicles near the building were destroyed. libyan's foreign ministry is calling it a terrorist attack. the first assault on an embassy in libya since september 11th when four americans died including our u.s. ambassador. bill: here we go. back now to capitol hill. breaking news on this hearing underway where a high-stakes battle on the hill over immigration reform. some republican lawmakers grilling homeland security secretary janet napolitano. that is chuck grassley there from iowa, arguing the bill could create a path to citizenship for 11 mill

illegals and does little to secure the u.s. border. we'll have a listen from a moment ago. >> the draft bill captures the core principles enunciated by president obama in las vegas and reflects the bipartisan spirit necessary to achieve comprehensive immigration reform. the bipartisan work reflected in this bill will strengthen security at our borders by funding the continued deployment of manpower infrastructure, air cover, and proven effective surveillance technologies along the highest trafficked areas of the southwest border. bill: chief congressional correspondent mike emanuel is tracking this live on the hill. mike, good morning to you. what has been her message so far? >> reporter: well, bill, secretary napolitano opened a bit talking about the boston attack a little over a week ago and she said that homeland security is committed to working with its partners to figure out what happened, exactly what steps can be taken to improve security and we'll

draw lessons learned from the incident. she has spoken in favor of this legislation. the bipartisan gang of eight immigration reform plan. she says it will improve security. it will improve the legal immigration system and now you mentioned that the top republican on the committee, senator chuck grassley, who has been pretty tough about this immigration reform legislation, he is starting to question her now. we expect if there will be fireworks, somebody like grassley will be the person who will get into it with secretary napolitano, bill. bill: you heard a lot of rumblings over the past several days suggesting the boston bombings may delay or complicate any effort for immigration reform. is that the case? what can we say about that at this point, mike? >> well that is certainly something that has gotten nerves exposed here on capitol hill. you have heard because the suspect brothers in boston were legal immigrants, some republicans have said, maybe we ought to take our time on this immigration reform, take a closer look at exactly led up to these guys

being able to pull off this attack and perhaps adjustments should be made to the immigration system. well that has led to some emotions. democrats saying don't tie boston and immigration reform together and senators chuck schumer and charles grassley got into it yesterday a bit on the hill when schumer talked about republicans wanting to put this off long term. grassley took off phones to -- offense to that. expect more emotion today, bill. bill: speaker boehner told us yesterday here on "america's newsroom" perhaps it will throw it off the tracks for a day or two but not permanently. mike thank you. martha. martha: here is a little bit of context on immigration in the u.s. the number of undocumented immigrants here expected to be at 11.1 million. that is the most, that is according to the most recent data in 2011. that same year, u.s. immigration and customs enforcement removed more than 396,000 immigrants that were living here illegally. that is the most in the agency's history. our country spent about 18

billion on immigration enforcement in 2012. a lot of money spent on this issue here. in fact it is more than the combined budgets of fbi, atf, dea and secret service. bill: well, here's a bomb shell. about a week after saying obamacare is a train wreck, democratic senator max baucus making mention moments ago that he will not seek re-election in the year 2015. martha: how about that. bill: he will retire early. if you were with us last hour, weed ha the clip from april 17th of last week. max baucus during a hearing with the health and human services secretary, kathleen sebelius, baucus, one of the architects of the obamacare law on the senate side said that everything he has seen right now leads the law being a train wreck. businesses don't know how to act. small businesses certainly don't know what to do. he is asking for more information and more data. all he is getting in his

word are concepts. now you have to face the voters with that behind you and figure out whether or not people will back you for re-election. here is what happened on april 17th. here is the exchange. >> i just see a huge train wreck many coming down. you and i discussed this many times and i don't see any result yet. what can you do to help all these people around the country are going what in the world do i do and what do i know what to do? bill: now we know what he is going to do. he will retire and won't seek office. martha: as you say, he was one of the architects of this bill. obviously, you know, had high hopes for it. thought that it was going to solve some of the problems. what he is saying is the administration has done a terrible job of --. bill: fixing issues and explaining it too. martha: yeah. that is pretty interesting development. he will not run. he will not retire. max baucus. we're hearing some of the chilling 9-1-1 tapes from the massive fertilizer plant explosion in west

texas. dozens of terrified people calling for help after that massive blast rocked their neighborhood last wednesday. at first many callers thought their home was affected. they went outside and saw what was crumbling all around them. didn't know what was happening. listen to this. >> all of our windows just broke. i don't know what happened and the house shook and the power went out. there is a cloud look at the that. look at that. something exploded. >> our whole house windows, everything, sounded like a bomb. there is a like a bomb on 35. i don't know what is going on. >> they're going to have to do something. we don't have a place to stay. >> we'll be out there to help you with your house as soon as we can. >> so sorry. >> oh, my god. martha: chilling, right the response to what was going on, and what they thought might have happened there. there were calls for an ambulance. firefighters, other

first-responders calling that they needed more help from anywhere they could get it. what a tragedy that was. and boy, you can understand the fear in those people's voices they didn't know what was happening around them. bill: we saw the images and aftermath of that, homes were blown off their foundation. like a tornado ripped through this. we're 10 minutes past the hour now. there is big day this week on thursday. president george bush, back in 2010 saying history will be the ultimate judge of his presidency. listen here. >> you think history will judge you fairly? >> yeah, they will. some historians will say, i really like what george bush did. some will say i really don't like what george bush did. you know when he did them. it will be hard for them to be able to an louisiana things objectively. bill: the reason why the question is so important because in his presidential library that opens in a few days, he asks that question, you decide. what would you have done faced with these decisions. there is polling, some

people, a lot of folks are warming up to the president. his former senior advisor karl rove is our guest out of austin, texas. we'll talk with him. martha: we'll look forward to that. there are new details emerging from president obama's budget proposal proposal will your taxes rise if this goes through. bill: how to prosecute the boston many bombing suspect. the man that prosecuted the shoe-bomber, richard reid. he will tell us dzhokhar tsarnaev's citizenship should be revoked and that is not all. [ male announcer ] how do you measure happiness?

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bill: here is breaking news on the economy now. sales of new homes up 1.5% in march. that is significant because it's the second fastest sales pace we've seen in three years. spring is buying time. apparently more americans are doing just that, just crossing the wires right now in 15 minutes. here in new york. martha: president

george w. bush reemerging on the national stage for the opening of his presidential library in texas. that will happen this thursday. but the move comes as some new polls out there show public image is improving. take a look at these numbers. very interesting. in february, 47% of americans say that they now approve of the job that president bush did. that is up significantly from 2008 when his overall approval rating was very low, at 23%. so, essentially a doubling of positive in that number. but over the last five years. president bush has repeatedly said, as he left the presidency, that really history would be the true judge of the decisions that he made. here he is during an interview in 2010. >> if you were to give yourself a letter grade on your eight years, what would it be? >> a for effort. a for love of country. a for assembling a fabulous

team. but history will judge the results and i'm not going to be around for history's final verdict. martha: interesting photo there of president bush walking out the door of the white house. i'm joined by karl rove, former senior advisor and deputy chief of staff of president george w. bush and a fox news contributor. welcome, good morning. what is your reaction when you listen to the president there? >> well, i heard that any number of times when was at the white house. i would read some editorial in the "new york times" and have steam coming out of my ears about 6:0 when he walk in the oval office and say history will get it right and we'll both be dead and who cares. first couple of times he said it irritated me. then i realized it is a great attitude. that is you want a president focused on doing the right thing and leave it up to history to judge. martha: i remember him saying i wake up had in the morning i look in the mirror and i'm okay with the guy that i see in the mirror and decisions that i made and history will judge. you look at some of these

numbers inside of these polls, karl, and his numbers have doubled on his handling of the economy. still a majority think that he didn't do a good job but the numbers of people who believe he did have doubled since he left office. and then you look -- go ahead. comment on that first. >> he, people are looking back now saying wait a minute, we had 52 months of continuous job growth. the economy was good for most of the time he was in there. the when the economic crisis came he provided decisive leadership. you know what? what he did to stablize banks and stablize auto companies we may not have agreed with it at the time but it worked and god bless him for having done that i think that is what time gives us. the chance to look back and put these things in a broader context. martha: you look at iraq, continues to be a troublesome number for president bush, probably the most controversial part of his presidency. but there, you're going to have the history complicated so much by what happened after he left office, in terms of you know, continuing to build those

societies and the intentions of why we went there in the first place are we not? >> yeah. yeah, look,. first of all, imagine how complicated the middle east would be today if saddam hussein were still in power or if he had died. his sons uday or kusay who were sadists. if they were in charge of iraq with huge oil reserves and attempting to get nuclear weapon the middle east would be a much worse than it is today. bush won the war by courageous decision about the surge. i would argue that president obama is sqaunledering the peace by failing get status of forces where he president obama, said was important for stablizing iraq an maintaining friendship with it for decades to come. president bush is content with the judgement of history. people are being able to look back and say, increasingly the things he did were right. we understand better why he did them and he is content with that.

martha: that will be interesting to see the library opening and sort of go back to some of those words and revisit that history as i know we're going to do on thursday. but you know, one of the constituencies that helped propel president bush into office was the hispanic vote. he had one of the strongest showings of that part of the voting population of recent presidents. that has changed in many ways for republicans and there's a story this morning in "politico" says if this immigration reform bill passes that that future is even more bleak in places lake nevada and colorado and ohio. think those wins would have been absolutely huge had this reform already passed in this time election. >> i read the story and i have a few quibbles with the story. it says for example, that there are 11 million illegal aliens and it assumes that all of them are hispanic. we know that is not true. in fact the pew charitable ust study which they base their numbers indicates that 75% or less are latino and other quarter come in from

visas from france and england and asia and africa. so not all of them are hispanic. will all the people become citizens? no. we don't know what percentage will you about we have pretty strong evidence some substantial number will take advantage fact they work here and return to their homeland when their retirement comes. so we don't know how many will actually apply for citizenship. this assumes all of them vote. and look in the last election between 44 and 53% of latinos who were elgible to vote, actually registered and turned out to vote. this study aumes that they will all vote. martha: understood. >> i would just remind people, past performance as they say in the investment world is not a guarranty of future, of future results because take a look at the last election. 27% turnout. 27% of hispanic vote for romney but in the seven battleground states with exit polling 32. in the battleground of battlegrounds of ohio, 42%. a strong campaign in a battleground state of ohio

yielded romney better than the number republicans need in order to be competitive at the national level. pretty close to bush's 44% that received nationwide among at lien toes in 2004. martha: very interesting, karl. we'll talk about this a little bit more coming up. have a good time at the library karl. we look forward to seeing it. >> are you going to be there? martha: we'll be watching from here. we're -- okay we'll go. we just got invited. >> come to texas. i got an extra ticket. martha: i will take it. bill: we need barbecue, karl. whatever you're serving. one of the cool things about the in two days you mentioned this early, very modern. ipads, all this stuff is interactive. what would you have done as an american faced with said decision? how would you decide? martha: right. bill: that will be --. martha: interesting interactive way to do it. so much history too. as the investigation in boston continues the attack changing the immigration debate in the senate. we'll have a look at that. martha: indeed we will.

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martha: smoking in new york city may soon get a little bit tougher. the city wants to raise the cigarette purchases from 18 to 21 like the drinking age he wants to prevent that. bill: president obama's budget proposal is coming under fire after the plan would hit higher earnings for taxes.

no it. >> most of those would fall on the books of people that make $200,000. is something the president talked about year after year. what is interesting about this new analysis, bill, is that people, they're also big tax increases on people that make $100,000. and people that make less than 100,000, people making 50 or $60,000 a year will be hit too because --. bill: sorry, how would those under $100,000 see their taxes go up? >> right. there is two proposals, bill. one is to substantially raise the cigarette tax. we know that is regressive tax. lower income people smoke than higher income people too. that will hit a lot of low income people. the other, remember the cpi change, the change in the chain weighting way we calculate social security

benefits, that would also change the way we calculate taxes owed each ear. there would be a bit of a tax increase that would accumulate over time on people that make less than $100,000. bill: here are the numbers we can show our viewers on the screen. millionaires under this budget proposal, $82,000 plus more. >> right. that's right. bill: 200 to $500,000, $2235 a year. 100 to $200,000 a year, you pay $150 more. you're making the case even under $100,000 you pay more as well. >> they will. bill: what about health care taxes? what about the medical device tax? >> exactly, there are a lot of other taxes that weren't even included in this analysis, bill. by the way the big one, don't forget this year we're paying more payroll tax. remember that one? payroll tax went up at the start of the year. people are feeling pinch on this. you mentioned other ones, obamacare bill has new taxes. medical device tax. tax on health insurance programs. people will get hit on all

sorts of different directions. don't foreget, this comes at a time when we also know from the income statistics where middle income families suffered a 2 or $3,000 decline since the recession. bill: the hole is so deep and tax everybody 100%, right? >> don't even talk about that, bill. that --. bill: that would, that would not even get us out of the hole. if it would, i guess maybe only for a short time here. you have to look at every hole and every corner of the country. to try and raise revenue. i think, the question goes, it is fine to talk about this budget proposal and to understand what the facts have been proposed but will it pass? and can it pass? >> i want to go back to the point you just made. it is really important point, bill. even if you took every penny of every military in the united states, you won't be able to balance the budget. what that suggests to me, wait a minute, if you want to raise taxes to balance this budget you have to go after the middle class because the old saying that is where the money is. whether this has a chance with passing with republican

house, i think odds are very low. i think they're committed to saying, mr. president, you got your tax increase in january, we're done raising taxes. bill: steve, thank you. of steve moore, "wall street journal" parsing the language for us. thank you, steve. >> thank you, bill. take care. bill: martha, what's next? martha: the case against the boston bombing suspect, we'll talk to the prosecutor from the shoe-bomber trial, and get his thoughts. bill: a lot of interesting thoughts. a 8th grader arrested for wearing a controversial t-shirt. what us did it say on the man's t-shirt? why he was accused nearly starting a riot. >> i never thought it would go this far because, honestly i don't see a problem with this. there shouldn't be a problem with this. we went out and asked people a simple question: how old is the oldest person you've known? we gave people a sticker and had them show us.

we learned a lot of us have known someone who's lived well into their 90s. and that's a great thing. but even though we're living longer, one thing that hasn't changed: the official retirement age. ♪ the question is how do you make sure you have the money you need to enjoy all of these years. ♪

pair bill: should they not have read his miranda rights to him yesterday if that is the case? do you leave the door of legal

opportunity open a while longer. >> there are two separate issues. the public safety exception applies regardless of the type of offense that the government is investigating, and using the public safety exception is recognized by the united states supreme court. it's a lawful way of trying to get information in a very short window of time tinge le particularly when you're concerned about public safety issues as the investigators certainly were as a result of the horrific acts that the bombing suspects, the bombing defendants who are h are accused of. bill: this is a guy to lived here more than ten years. came here 2002 if memory serves. your case with richard reid he was far from an american citizen, he was far from even making a home here. what have we done in 12 years? make sure that the prosecutions can be successful? >> i would suggest that we should be using all the tools

that both the united states supreme court has indicated are available in order to keep america safe, and all the tools the united states congress has provided to be sure america continues to be safe. that includes tools like public safety exception for purposes of interview and interrogation of somebody when you believe that there is a significant imminent public safety risk. beyond that you're considering whether or not designating somebody as an enemy combatant actually advances our national security. we've done it previously, we should continue to use those tools that are available to us. bill: how do you think they've done so far in the 15 or 20 seconds i have left here? >> well, i think law enforcement has done and extraordinary job, lightning speed in terms of identification and apprehension. now the prosecutors and investigators will be methodical going through the evidence to make sure that they are building a terrific case. and beyond that identifying whether or not there are others involved. bill: michael sullivan thank you. we'll call on you again real soon and draw on your expertise as we move through this.

michael sullivan, live from boston. >> thanks, bill. bill: you bet. martha: as airlines prepare to start flying boeing 787 dreamliners again federal investigators are beginning a two-day hearing to find out why they kept causing fires in the first place. dan springer is live from seattle. why do they hold the hearings after the plane is cleared to fly? >> reporter: the national transportation safety board is charged with investigating while the faa eurs the regulatory agency. there has been some coordination on the 787 battery problem. the faa typically does not wait until the ntsb has finished its investigation. the ntsb p takes a long type. the normal investigation lasts well over a year and there are two months into the battery fire probe and there's been no determination of a cause. they do know the li lithium ion battery overheated and that led to overheating and a fire.

they are including a redesigned battery with better insulation between the cells and a better steel containment box that engineers say won't allow for any air to fuel a fire. they've redesigned the charge erp sore the battery doesn't have to work as hard. the faa has given approval to that fix and boeing says it could have its planes back in the air with the airlines flying customers again by the end of next week. back to you, martha. martha: that's been quite a story. dan, thank you. bill: from capitol hill the tempers are flaring today. have a look at this right here. >> i say that particularly those who are pointing to what happened the terrible tragedy in boston as i would say an excuse for not doing a bill, or delaying it many months or years. >> i never said that. >> i didn't say you did. >> i never said that. >> i didn't say you did, sir. bill: the on. is the fallout from the boston bombings beginning to reshape the debate on immigration reform? we'll look at that. martha: you may soon have to say goodbye to tax-free online

shopping. oh, no. we'll explain that one. we'll be right back. ♪ i'm the tax man, yeah, i'm the tax man. should 5% appear to small. ♪

martha: a top republican senator is now objecting to a claim that members of his party were using the boston terror attack as an excuse to delay immigration reform. this is an important hearing on

this matter that is underway right now. meanwhile things got a little bit tense yesterday after democratic senator charles schumer made these comments, watch this exchange. >> the chairman has a very open process, so a few ways to improve the bill offer an amendment in may and let's vote on it. i say that particularly to those who are pointing to what happened, the terrible tragedy in boston as i would say an excuse for not doing a bill or delaying it many months or years. >> i never said that. >> i didn't say you did. >> i never said that. >> i didn't say you did, sir. i didn't say you did. i don't mean you mr. grassley. >> chairman i don't appreciate you demeaning the witnesses that are coming here. martha: tempers flaring at that hearing. i'm joined by bob beckel, former campaign manager and host of the 5. and mary kathrineham, editor of

fox news.com and a fox news contributor -fpblt what do you think about those trying to delay this and use boston as an excuse for it. >> there is nothing about an immigration bill that would have stopped what happened in months ton with these two brothers. i'd go the other way and say i think the immigration bill is strengthened because of what happened in boston. the reason for that is that the requirements and how strict the new immigration bill calls for for people coming into this country, and being investigated, and being deported, are much stronger than any we've had before. i think that is probably a much more compelling case for immigration reform. >> mary kathrine? >> the bomb line it's a 900-page bill. i think congress has with most e of the public a competence problem, that they can pass something that will not endanger

folks. even one of the coauthors wanted more hearings because he understands that opening up the process can maybe gain you some trust from people, because they've had many chances to do enforcement and people look at the situation and go, hey they haven't matched up to their promises. so i think there is legitimate skepticism on that front. in one of the hearings, this is the part that gets me, they held friday, they will only have two of them, they held it friday on the biggest news day in the last ten years. not a lot of people paying a lot of tension. that is what is getting to people. and grassley doesn't appreciate being accusinged of demagogging the situation when he's asking legitimate questions about having an open process about having a 900-page bill. martha: has there been enough discussion on this problem with? it's an important thing to get right. you have a lot of people who want to see the borders secure as part of the bill. there is a lot to debate here. >> there is. there hasn't been comprehensive immigration renorm since 1986, it's been a longtime. martha: good point. >> that was the simpson mazoli

bill under the reagan administration. a lot of that the enforcement, and you're exactly right about enforcement has not been doing very well either for people who came here undocumented or the employers who hired them. this new bill does deal with that in a much more -- in a stronger way and a credible way. the other thing i'd say about this is this new bill calls for allowing people po sta to stay here undocumented who got here 2011 or before. it puts very strong restriction -gs who comes in afterwards. if it's up to me, this caused a big stir, i think at to point we need to stop the process of issuing visas, particularly to muslim students. ta i can a two year hiatus, those who are accepted stay here. those accepted form the fall can come in and go to college. this are countries around the world where people just don't like us and we are admitting people into this country 102,000 from saudi arabia last year? i mean that seems to be to me to be a little extreme. martha: there is an interesting exchange i want to bring your

attention to that is going on in this hearing right now between lindsey graham and janet napolitano. we will get into it more later. the gist of it is why didn't we know about tamerlan's trip to russia, given the fact that he had been -- he had been, you know, asked questions already by the fbi, and at one point janet napolitano in this hearing today suggested, well he pinged on the way out. we picked him up on the way out. mike levine sailed he was on a very large watch list not a terror watch list that doesn't have a whole lot of significance. the big thing here, bob is are we doing what we need to be doing in terms of keeping track of people who have been on the radar in this country, or are we throwing up our hands and saying we can't find anything on them so we are done with that. >> this is the third time the fbi has let people slip through their fingers. they interviewed the guy before he went to russia. then he went to russia in an area near chechnya and he was there for six months.

at that point it would seem to me it would trigger something, somewhere along the line. martha: you would think. >> this guy has been an increased threat as a potential terrorist, not a terrorist but an increased threat and therefore he should be watched. i think it was a terrible mistake by somebody. martha: i can't figure out -- what do you have a terror watch list for if this guy is not on it if he's not on it who is on it? >> let me echo the reason he's able to freely travel back and forth is because he was a legal resident and not being able to flag that is ha weakness in the system. of it doesn't mean that all the people under this bill that would get legal residency would be dangerous but you need to figure out how the heck you're making that distinction and whether you're following it on it. that's a reasonable question to ask. people like schumer don't want that asked because it will slow down the process mr. that's a legitimate list, if you have a terrorist list doesn't that qualify? i'm close to being on the

terrorist list. they can't have this guy it. >> my son as a real name and a nickname and it's hard to get on a plane. i'm trying to figure all this out. more on this later on the 5. mary kathrine, thanks. bill: "happening now" rolls our way, jenna what are you working on? jenna: i bet bob is on a lot of lists. we will follow-up on your conversation just there. senator rand paul will join us. what does all of this mean for the state of immigration reform. he says it should be slowed down, he's urging a caucus approach. his arguments heard in moments. multiple terrorism stories making headlines today from boston to canada to an attack overseas. senator graham who you also just mentioned is here. he says we need to up our game against radical islam. what does he mean by that specifically? top of the hour on "happening now." bill: we'll see you then. business news for millions who shop online, there is a push to get you to pay more just to point, click and ship. the tax man cometh, folks. @ñ@@

>> tax-free shopping might be a thing of the past. on the internet could soon be in jeopardy thanks to a bill making its way through the senate. our chief congressional washington correspondent james rosen live on this story. so, paying more, what is the white house saying about this. james? >> they are in support of it, bill. this issue has surfacerred many timesuredsurfaced at both the state and federal level. the u.s. senate voted 74-20 to take up the marketplace fairness act for debate and amendment, a move that white house press secretary jay carney applauded saying that the administration has carefully considered the legislation, brought with a broad array of people on the issue, including governors, mayor the business community and

it's time to, quote, level the playing field between internet retailers and brick and mortar stores. the house exphebgted to i can expected to take up an identical measure fairly swiftly. bill: who is oppose th-g. >> you have the antitax crusaders people like grover for question is, and online retailers are not thrilled at the idea: proposed law would require all of them except those that aren't clearing more than a million dollars a year to collect sales taxes for the state and local governments where the buyers reside. and the states would be required to provide the requisite software for them to do it. this process will prove especially complicated for online retailers in the four states where there is no income tax, those are delaware, montana, new hampshire and oregon, bill. bill: thank you, james. watch it, we'll see if it goes anywhere. james rosen in washington. martha: new details now emerging

about a possible motive in the 4 boston bombings, what the sur sraoeufrg t-fpt i surinamese jiving suspect is now saying and -pt new charges he could be facing, that's coming up. here we go. honey cornflakes and chunks of greek yogurt. i'm tasting both the yogurt and the honey at the same time. i'm like digging this yogurt thing. i feel healthy. new honey bunches of oats greek.

bill: i think we are on. we don't want to be like that guy in montana, right? jenna: which guy. jon: the guy in money than that a who came on his air his first debut and dropped a couple of bombs. jenna: he dropped